211 – Gena Thomas, Author of Separated by the Border: A Birth Mother, a Foster Mother, and a Migrant Child’s 3,000-Mile Journey

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Gena Thomas is a writer and speaker who works at a nonprofit that empowers others through holistic development. She served as a missionary in northern Mexico for four years, holds a master’s degree in international development, and is the author of A Smoldering Wick: Igniting Missions Work with Sustainable Practices. She lives in Chattanooga, Tennessee, with her husband, Andrew, and their two children.

In 2017 five-year-old Julia traveled with her mother, Guadalupe, from Honduras to the United States. Her harrowing journey took her through Mexico in the cargo section of a tractor trailer. Then she was separated from her mother, who was held hostage by smugglers who exploited her physically and financially. At the United States border, Julia came through the processing center as an unaccompanied minor after being separated from her stepdad who was deported. Gena Thomas tells the story of how Julia came to the United States, what she experienced in the system, and what it took to reunite her with her family. A Spanish-speaking former missionary, Gena became Julia’s foster mother and witnessed firsthand the ways migrant children experience trauma. Weaving together the stories of birth mother and foster mother, this book shows the human face of the immigrant and refugee, the challenges of the immigration and foster care systems, and the tenacious power of motherly love. -From the Publisher

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210 – Latasha Morrison, Author and Founder of Be The Bridge, on Why the Church is Sometimes the Hardest Place for People of Color

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Latasha Morrison is a bridge-builder, reconciler, and a compelling voice in the fight for racial justice. Ebony magazine recognized her as one of their 2017 Power 100 for her work as a community crusader. Tasha has spoken across the country at events that include: IF:Gathering, Justice Conference, Youth Specialties, Catalyst, Orange Conference, MOPS International and many others. A native of North Carolina, Tasha earned degrees in human development and business leadership. In 2016 she founded Be the Bridge to inspire and equip ambassadors of racial reconciliation. In addition to equipping more than 1,000 sub-groups across five countries, Be the Bridge hosts a closed, moderated online community of bridge-builders on Facebook with more than 20,000 members.

Find a Be The Bridge Chapter

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A leading advocate for racial reconciliation offers a clarion call for Christians to move toward relationship and deeper understanding in the midst of a divisive culture.

With racial tensions as high within the church as outside the church, it is time for Christians to become the leaders in the conversation on racial reconciliation. This power-packed guide helps readers deepen their understanding of historical factors and present realities, equipping them to participate in the ongoing dialogue and to serve as catalysts for righteousness, justice, healing, transformation, and reconciliation. -From the Publisher

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208 – Natalie Frisk on Raising Disciples

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Natalie Frisk is the curriculum pastor at The Meeting House Church in Toronto, Canada, where she and a team create kids’ and youth curricula for ages 0–18 used by churches worldwide. Frisk is a sought-after speaker on topics of youth and children’s ministry, spiritual formation, and discipleship, and her work has been published in Canadian Youth Workers Magazine and at the ReKnew and Pangea blogs. Frisk has a master’s degree in theological studies from McMaster Divinity College and serves on the board of Be in Christ Church of Canada. She is married to Sam, mom to Erin, and child of God. She loves Jesus, coffee, and samosas.

Children and youth will just “catch” the faith of their parents, right?

Not necessarily. Talking with kids about Jesus no longer comes naturally to many Christian parents. In Raising Disciples, pastor Natalie Frisk helps us reconnect faith and parenting, equipping parents to model what following Jesus looks like in daily life. Filled with authenticity, flexibility, humor, and prayer, Frisk outlines how parents can make openings for their children to experience God in their daily lives.

As curriculum pastor at The Meeting House, one of the largest churches in Canada, Frisk calls parents who follow Christ to ask the big questions about the spiritual formation of children and teens. In practical and thoughtful ways, she equips parents to disciple their kids in various stages of childhood, adolescence, and young adulthood. Raising Disciples will awaken parents to the possibly of Jesus-centered parenting and encourage us to engage in the lost art of discipling our own kids. – From the Publisher

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207 – Glenn Packiam Talks ‘Blessed Broken Given: How Your Story Becomes Sacred in the Hands of Jesus’

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Glenn Packiam is an Associate Senior Pastor at New Life Church, a multi-congregational church in Colorado Springs. He also serves as the Lead Pastor of New Life Downtown, a thriving New Life congregation in the heart of the city. An ordained Anglican priest serving in a non-denominational church, Packiam treasures Christian practices that are both ancient and modern. He has a doctorate from Durham University, UK. Glenn, his wife Holly, and their four children live in Colorado Springs.

An invitation to find beauty and meaning in the ordinary and imperfect aspects of your life; not as a call to settle for less, but rather as a way to mysteriously participate in God’s power and purpose. Glenn Packiam wants to empower readers to find great joy, purpose, and passion in their daily living. While bread may be one of the most common items on our dinner tables, Jesus chose to take it at the Last Supper and invest deep, wonderful, and transcendent meaning in it. Like the bread that was blessed, broken, and given; readers will see how God uses ordinary experiences to cultivate their mission and their brokenness to bring healing to the world. The ordinary is not the enemy; it is the means by which God accomplishes the miraculous. Through clear biblical teaching and practical steps, Packiam leads the reader into a more purposeful, directed, hopeful future. -From the Publisher

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206 – Christena Cleveland on whitemalegod and More!

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Christena Cleveland Ph.D. is a social psychologist, public theologian, author, and activist. She is the founder and director of the recently-launched Center for Justice + Renewal, a non-profit dedicated to helping justice advocates sharpen their understanding of the social realities that maintain injustice while also stimulating the soul’s enormous capacity to resist and transform those realities. Committed to leading both in scholarly settings and in the public square, Christena writes regularly, speaks widely, and consults with organizations.

Dr. Cleveland holds a Ph.D. in social psychology from the University of California Santa Barbara as well as an honorary doctorate from the Virginia Theological Seminary. She integrates psychology, theology, and art to stimulate our spiritual imaginations. An award-winning researcher and author, Christena has held faculty positions at several institutions of higher education — most recently at Duke University’s Divinity School, where she led a research team investigating self-compassion as a buffer to racial stress. She is currently working on her third book which examines the relationship among race, gender, and cultural perceptions of the Divine. Dr. Cleveland is based in North Carolina where she lives with her spouse, Jim.

To follow what Christena is doing, check out her Patreon page at Patreon.com/cscleve

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Seminary Dropout Sermon Special: Wholeness Between Ourselves and the Universe

Shane concludes a Guiding Values series by teaching about Wholeness. At Austin Mustard Seed we believe that God is in the process of restoring our lives, those around us, and all creation to shalom, or wholeness. Whether through spiritual disciplines, practicing mercy, creation care, offering forgiveness, or encouraging wholeness, our pain is transformed. We become bearers of the good news, actively participating in God’s ongoing work of renewal. We were invited to consider how as a church we can come alongside God’s work of bringing restoration and wholeness to the world.

205 – Did Paul Believe Husbands Are the ‘Head’ of Their Wives or that Women Should Wear Head Coverings? Lucy Peppiatt Has Some Answers.

Lucy Peppiatt (PhD, Otago) is the principal of Westminster Theological Centre. Her research interests are Christ and the Spirit, charismatic theology, discipleship, and 1 Corinthians, and her books include Unveiling Paul’s Women and Women and Worship in Corinth.

This Week on Seminary Dropout…

Lucy Peppiatt (PhD, Otago) is the principal of Westminster Theological Centre. Her research interests are Christ and the Spirit, charismatic theology, discipleship, and 1 Corinthians, and her books include Unveiling Paul’s Women and Women and Worship in Corinth.

Rediscovering Scripture’s Vision for Women: Fresh Perspectives on Disputed Texts

Does God call women to serve as equal partners in marriage and as leaders in the church?The answer to this straightforward question is deeply contested. Into the fray, Lucy Peppiatt offers her work on interpretation of the Bible and Christian practice. With careful exegetical work, Peppiatt considers relevant passages in Ephesians, Colossians, 1 Peter, 1 Timothy, and 1 Corinthians. There she finds a story of God releasing women alongside men into all forms of ministry, leadership, work, and service on the basis of character and gifting, rather than biological sex. Those who see the overturning of male-dominated hierarchy in the Scriptures, she argues, are truly rediscovering an ancient message―a message distorted by those who assumed that a patriarchal world, which they sometimes saw reflected in the Bible, was the one God had ordained. -From the Publisher

Unveiling Paul’s Women: Making Sense of 1 Corinthians 11:2–16Whether people realize it or not, the ideas in 1 Corinthians 11:2-16 have had a huge impact on the role of Christian women in the church through the centuries. These fifteen verses have shaped worship practices, church structures, church leadership, marriages, and even relationships between men and women in general. They have contributed to practices that have consistently placed women in a subordinate role to men, and have been used to justify the idea that a woman should not occupy a leadership or teaching position without being under the authority or “covering” of a man. It is strange, therefore, that academics and pastors alike continue to note how confusing and difficult it continues to be to make sense of these very verses. In this little book, Lucy Peppiatt not only highlights the problems associated with using this text to justify the subordination of women, but offers a clear and plausible re-reading of the text that paints the apostle Paul as a radical, visionary, church planter who championed women in all forms of leadership. -From the Publisher

Women and Worship at Corinth: Paul’s Rhetorical Arguments in 1 Corinthians Making sense of Paul’s arguments in 1 Corinthians 11-14 regarding both the role of women in public worship and the value of tongues and prophecy for the unbeliever has long posed challenges for any lay reader or scholar. Despite numerous explanations offered over the years, these passages remain marked by inconsistencies, contradictions, and puzzles. Lucy Peppiatt offers a reading of 1 Corinthians 11-14 in which she proposes that Paul is in conversation with the Corinthian male leadership regarding their domineering, superior, and selfish practices, including coercing the women to wear head coverings, lording it over the “have-nots” at the Lord’s Supper, speaking in tongues all at once, and ordering married women to keep quiet in church. Through careful exegesis and theological comment this reading not only brings internal coherence to the text, but paints a picture of the apostle gripped by a vision for a new humanity “in the Lord” resulting in his refusal to compromise with the traditional views of his own society. Instead, as those who should identify with the crucified Christ, he exhorts the Corinthians to make “love” their aim, and thus to restore dignity and honor to women, the outsider, and the poor. -From the Publisher

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Seminary Dropout Sermon Special: Women in Ministry

Shane speaks about why we as a community ordain women into pastoral leadership and ministry.

Book Resources

  • The Blue Parakeet -Scott McKnight
  • Emboldened: A Vision for Empowering Women in Ministry -Tara Beth Leach
  • Half the Church: Recapturing God’s Global Vision for Women -Carolyn Custis James
  • Two Views on Women in Ministry (Counterpoints: Bible and Theology)
  • Slaves, Women, and Homosexuals -William Webb
  • Women in the Earliest Christian Churches -Ben Witherington
  • Ordained Women in the Early Church -Kevin Madigan
  • Hidden History of Women’s Ordination -Gary Macy

Websites//Blogs//Podcasts

Rebroadcast: Seminary Dropout 83: Rachel Held Evans

Rachel Held Evans

Rachel Held Evans is a tremendously successful blogger and author. Many believers have found a refuge in her writings. You can follow her on her blog at rachelheldevans.com and on twitter at @rachelheldevans.

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Rachel’s new book is Searching for Sunday. SfS is about Rachel’s own journey from a simple faith too one with more complexity and subtleties. Many believers, especially of the younger generations will see much of their own story in her’s. Leaving the church, starting a new one, facing failure, and finding a different form of church, Rachel brings us along for the ride.

Some things discussed on the show…

…when going through major doubt and Christians blame you for your doubt,  ‘they aren’t rejecting you for being different, they’re rejecting you for being familiar’.

…when your own theological house falls down sometimes you start throwing rocks at other people houses.

…Rachel’s propensity to talk about very serious and borderline depressing subjects at social functions.

…Rachel could sell more if you just ‘crapped’ on the church and didn’t make an effort to highlight the positive things that happen with churches.

…many boiled down Rachel’s journey as going from evangelicalism to the mainline and that’s really oversimplified and half-true.

…my families own journey without a church last year.


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